Timing lock jumper does not work with Neptune?

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Timing lock jumper does not work with Neptune?

Coupe-r Thu Jan 10, 2019 2:08 am

I know we can lock timing via the software.

However for customers that are changing dizzy and need to reset timing, I have found the timing doesn't lock using the factory 2 wire jumper pin....
timing still seemed to move around vs locking via the laptop which was rock solid.

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Coupe-r Sun Jan 20, 2019 6:47 am

I guess my question is. Has any one else noticed this?
Is this intentional?
It makes things Pretty hard for Chip tuned customers if they need to set timing after the tune, aftermarket
Dizzy can often have different trigger offsets also, so marking head/dizzy isnít good enough.

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HRTuning Sun Jan 20, 2019 1:51 pm

If the service connector behavior hasn't been changed in settings it's still factory.

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JVDE Fri Jan 25, 2019 10:56 am

Isn't there an option in Neptune to lock the ignition @12į?
It's been too long for me to be sure

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HRTuning Fri Jan 25, 2019 4:21 pm

You choose what to lock it to.

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Coupe-r Wed Apr 03, 2019 8:12 am

ok I finally bench tested this today, because few of my customers were complaining it wasn't working.

Confirmed service check connector input Pin D4 on the ECU does NOT lock the timing using Neptune maps. It does however disable ignition adjustments (like idle control ignition advance/retard) This is with service check connector function as normal (not re-purposed for another input)

it certainly does not lock the timing to your set 16 degrees. ONLY timing lock in the software works, meaning chip based end users have no way of locking and setting their own timing.

Check light off shown below (table timing 24, actual 20.75 when I would expect 19.25 actual?
(24 table - 5.25 idle error + 0.50 RPM based ignition adjustment =19.25 degrees) But thats getting off track for this question about timing lock.



Service check connection enabled (ONLY ignition adjustments active NOT locked to 16)



Finally using Neptune timing lock gets me to 16 degrees

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HRTuning Wed Apr 03, 2019 9:22 pm

Actually, you raising the idle to outside of where ignition would be 16.5 is why it's not locked at 16. As you'll notice from your photos it does lock timing to what's in the table (See photo 1 vs photo 2), which would be 16 from the factory at factory idle. Feel free to adjust the ignition table to appropriately be 16.5 in the idle area if you'd like it to lock to 16.5 when jumped.

There's more than just idle ignition adjustments at play, which should make apparent why it's not table-idle adjustment only during normal operation.

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Coupe-r Thu Apr 04, 2019 7:37 am

So what you are saying is, the factory Honda timing lock jumper ONLY disables adjustments. It doesn't actually lock timing to 16.
It just locks to what ever cell its reading from at the time... hmmm interesting.

This will only work for cars that have idle timing at 16, and if they are idling low enough.
Thanks for clearing that up

Cool

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HRTuning Thu Apr 04, 2019 7:56 am

Exactly. Every factory set of maps, regardless of ECU type, has 16.5 near and around the idle target for that ECU.

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Relic1 Thu Apr 04, 2019 5:31 pm

HRTuning wrote:Exactly. Every factory set of maps, regardless of ECU type, has 16.5 near and around the idle target for that ECU.

It's been a while but doesn't the manual mention to set the timing with the engine at 800rpm or below?? (this would make perfect sense, never thought of why it would be needed before)

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Coupe-r Thu Apr 04, 2019 8:15 pm

Yes the HELMS manual does state that.

Kinda a noob oversight on my part. I always assumed timing lock just FACTORY locked to 16 degrees.

Thats obviously not correct though, its a timing adjustment disable Wink

So depending on what engine you have, where your timing mark is, you MUST have your idle timing set to that. So B series 16 degrees. (what is interesting is the factory B series maps are 16.5 degrees haha)
H22A 15 degrees
H22AR 12 degrees

Sorry for the silly question. Its so obvious now

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HRTuning Thu Apr 04, 2019 8:35 pm

All good! Being in this industry for nearly 20 years, you never stop learning.

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Coupe-r Thu Apr 04, 2019 11:09 pm

Indeed! Also shows how important the SOFTWARE timing lock is. Many cars won't have the idle timing set to the mark on the pulley (raising idle up on a fussy engine etc)

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HRTuning Fri Apr 05, 2019 2:56 pm

Definitely part of why the option was added!

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